Topic: PlayStation 5 --OT--

@Jaz007 oh - I’ve always wondered how that works when you request from a PC to download something. Might have to try that.

lol. The stream is brilliant. They're straight up trolling, they're showing the same old demo they've shown for years, the one with the moving platform and the lava floor.

Anyway, Dreams beta coming tomorrow!

@LieutenantFatman Good point. We can only guess but if Death Stranding was on PS5 that's reason enough for me to grab one. But other than that I'm not so sure.

The tech has come almost as far as I need it too. If we can have a better VR experience and 4k 60fps gaming on screen then I don't think I would ever need to upgrade again after the ps5.

PS5 - that will be a day one for me no matter what, hopefully it will be compatible with PS4 titles from the get go, with all the investment into live service games and all, makes no sense making you buy another version of the title.

So I personally expect PS5 to be announced next year and released March 2020. Word has it it was planned to release next year as well but the system level/OS/Backend stuff is a bit behind schedule. Sony is teasing something big next year so it makes sense. Switch proved March can work. It will sell out anyway so launch earlier to refine the supply chain and focus on software bundles for thr holiday.

And before someone says it'll hurt their Q4 2019 sales, Switch and Xbox One X wave hi.

@WebHead Switch and Xbox One X wave? As opposed to them being outsold now? What wave?

@WebHead Switch - yes but the Xbox One X launched November 2017 - around a year after the Pro and in time for the Christmas season.

I know its not 'essential' to release in time for Christmas - as the Switch proved but some of that was down to hardware/software not being ready to launch in time - the usual reason that consoles miss the pre-Christmas window.

I do find the public perception rather bizarre - Nov 2019 is too soon but Mar 2020 is OK - just 4 months, difference and likely to get most/all of the Nov 2019 games re-released for launch - we saw that with the PS4/XB1 too with games like Fifa, CoD, BF4, AC4:BF, Lego Marvel, Madden etc getting multiple releases for the old gen and then again for the different launch dates of the PS4 and XB1 versions.

Personally, I would prefer to buy a console before Christmas and buy the games once - not two generation versions of the same game. If I know the PS5 is launching in March, I think I would clear up my backlog instead of buying PS4 versions and get them in March with the PS5 instead...

@Jaz007 I meant as in say hi. What I mean is Scorpio(One X) and switch announcements didnt effect 2016 holiday sales for Xbox and Nintendo. Also tax return season i would say is probably an easier time to buy new hardware for many I would assume.

@BAMozzy
All is fair enough. We are just more or less wild guessing here. What do you think of Xbox next gen console then? Wouldn't it makes sense that what works for Sony also applies to Ms considering only the hardware perspective? So why 2020 or 2019? (I'm personally thinking the software matters a lot for choosing a launch date but whatever) Not that I'm interested in Xbox but both consoles obviously are important for an overall picture.
I think a new Xbox will launch next year as a streaming machine. That s some more food for thoughts.
Also the media seems to push the idea the Xbox is set to dominate next gen which is a bit silly a assumption at this stage, not to say a suspicious stance.

@JJ2 Personally I feel MS is in more desperate need to release a follow up - that's coming from someone who bought a Project Scorpio edition X on day 1 (and still own my original XB1 with Kinect as that's how it was sold at the time and an Gears 4 XB1s). All you have to do is look at how the 'base' console(s) are coping with the current games and you will see that of the big 2, the XB1 looks like it will be the first that games will be 'impossible' to run at a 'reasonable' visual settings, at least 720p and 30fps. That 'maybe' good enough for some that don't want to invest in 'new' hardware yet but realistically, this generation has held back game development and the XB1 is struggling more than PS4.

Of course it could depend on whether MS would be willing to allow 3rd party games to release on just the X - the X becoming the 'new' base console effectively as it has a lot of the next gen features you could expect. It could be the '4k/30' entry level console with the 'nextbox' being the new 'high' end 4k/60 console - higher average res, double the frame rate and maybe having 'higher' visual settings too. It makes more sense to do that. It maybe that some games won't run on the X but with the 'resources' it currently has, its possible that they could drop res down to 1080-1440p to get games working - especially if they also can be 30fps on X but are 60fps on Nextbox. Either way, the current Base hardware is much more in need of being replaced and can't really drop much more to get them running. You could I guess start offering CB rendering - 2x540p (or 960x1080) to 'fake HD' but realistically, its showing its age more so therefore MS are more in need. Sony have run away with this gen, MS's E32013 left a sour taste too - even though they back tracked very quickly and very few elements that people hated actually made it to release - the final issue, Kinect, was gone from bundles within 6 months too. It could be a good idea to end this generation sooner where as Sony may want to drag their 'heels' a bit more to milk their success.

I can understand why the Media may well be thinking that MS will dominate, the massive amount of Money that they have to throw at winning, as well as the acquisition/formation of 7 new studios in the last 6months or so and basically given them a 'blank cheque' to make whatever games they want and expected to add more studio's, the fact they have Cloud Computing with Azure, the fact that MS have stated they are 'prioritising' gaming to be as 'big' as any other aspect of MS - not just a little 'side project' - so much so that its become important to the 'heads' of MS - not the 'Xbox' division but MS - hence all the 'massive' injection of money into gaming - Its easy to understand why the Media are thinking that MS will dominate. Whether it will sell as many consoles is a different matter because Xbox isn't 'just' the console, its just their 'console' device for gaming with Xbox on PC's as well as Tablets and Mobiles too. I know some still see 'PC' as a 'separate' entity but they want to amalgamate ALL their Windows 10/MS customers into one big user base - the hardware is immaterial so if you prefer the PC structure, so be it, want a console MS will build you one... As long as you have an MS account, with an MS profile, you can sign in and play your games on any MS powered device - In theory, this could open up 3rd Party Consoles too from HP, Acer etc too much like you can buy a MS Surface or HP, Acer equivalent - the important aspect is the 'network' - your profile, your games library all linked and the hardware is just the 'means' on which you play but you are ALL part of the MS network - just like you are all part of the Playstation Nation and your profile is what allows you to play on PS4, PS3, Vita and soon PS5. Gone is the day where you bought a console and anyone could play any game, now its all linked to your profile and you 'need' a profile to play - even Physical these days. You can go to ANY PS4 anywhere and Sign in with your GT and have access to your Digital library and all your Trophies etc and that I see will be the future - except with MS, that includes PC's because they pretty much all have MS OS and could be Tablets/Mobiles with cloud computing as long as they are powered by MS OS just like their console...

Sony 'could' do something similar I guess with their next console - sign into your PSN account on a Sony Xperia Mobile or Sony Bravia TV and play any of your games - add to your Trophies and carry on Playing on the go via cloud computing /streaming to mobile but I do think MS has the infrastructure in place now and the resources to make it work. Again, it may mean that they don't sell as many consoles - but as far as user base and software sales go, they could 'dominate' - although fanboys will still quote console sales as being representative of users but as far as numbers of gamers active on MS servers playing games as a unified user base, MS could very easily dominate.

I wonder how much the PS5 release will affect PS4 sales. It’s not unheard-of for the last generation of consoles to outsell the new one in its first year. I very much doubt the people who are buying the PS4 slim is at this point in its life cycle of the same people who will be pre-ordering the PS5.

@BAMozzy

'Its easy to understand why the Media are thinking that MS will dominate.'
Actually no. You also say 'fanboys will quote console sales' but these media very much mean consoles sales. I agree that Ms is going for a market bigger than consoles but we r talking about consoles.
The thing everything is much of a big fog right now (regarding consoles) and its really too early to build castles in the sky. Ms learned the hard way In. 2013.
The fact is Ms has never dominated the console (hardware) space so it's somehow bold to throw that sort of projection.
What I meant to ask you is if you think new gen Xbox would launch at the same time as PS5 since you think it could be next year apparently.

@Ryall The PS1 was made right up until less than a year before the PS3 launched and the PS2 right up until less than a year before the PS4. The PS3 has already ended in terms of manufacturing but it is still supported. This shows that Sony won't immediately abandon the PS4 when the PS5 launches and no doubt will get games launching on it too for at least a year or two. Obviously the amount of games releasing dropped as it became more difficult and less cost effective to port down but there is always a transitional period with Sony consoles. The PS4 could get a sizeable drop in price too and people may buy for the plethora of games it already has.

@JJ2 Console sales is just one aspect of 'domination' and games, game sales etc is another. MS dominating the market isn't just in terms of console sales...

Whether MS will release at the same time or not really depends on their plans moving forward. I do think they may need to release around Nov 2019 if they don't allow the X to receive some 'unique' software or become the 'new' base level for the near future. The fact that the base is virtually on its last legs from a hardware perspective, without using CB rendering to deliver HD quality - assuming that's the 'minimum' acceptable - they could drop below 720p I guess and we know first party games can be tailored to the hardware. Again its dependent on what games are in development and whether they are specifically looking at the XB1 as the lowest spec to build for or looking more to advancing games and hoping they can scale it down to Base hardware for sales. The fact that Sony have more in reserve so to speak does mean they could drop the resolution a bit more to extract more performance to run games where as Xbox seems at its limit - unless it drops below HD - so therefore I think MS would have to release before or at the latest, at the same time as Sony because the Base XB1 is struggling more to deliver acceptable gaming.

It does depend on what MS want to do with the X. They could announce a 'new' console and in the interim, allow some games to release just on the X if they state its the 'new' base hardware for the next generation and the 'new' console coming is the 'new' enhanced Xbox - like I said, the X has a LOT of next gen features so could become the 'low spec' or entry level nextbox. That could buy them time to release late 2020 with much higher specs. It does kind of do away with the traditional 'generation' format that Sony are adhering too and would extend the X's life span. Instead of releasing a new generation every 5/6yrs, MS just release a iterative upgrade every 3/4yrs, phasing out the oldest (6-8yr old hardware), with the 3-4yr old high end becoming the 'base' for 3-4yrs at the tail end of its life and the 'newest' being the high end. If Sony follow the same format as PS4, you could still get a 'iterative Pro' console after 3-4yrs, but as soon as the next console arrives, both the base and Pro will be phased out together so the Pro essentially has a much shorter life. Again, it really depends on what MS plan to do. If they are sticking to generations, then they need to replace the XB1 sooner but they could just have the X for a year and then bring out a iterative 'Next' box as the 'iterative high end Xbox.

Its more complicated because of comments made prior to the X release - the fact MS wanted to move away from generational releases and be more like 'PC's' that get iterative upgrades and the weakest CPU/GPU's get phased out. You don't see games locked to GTX 9 series and the new Generation GTX10 series and now GTX20 series GPU's getting their own games. It just depends on what that means to MS of course and whether or not they do opt to go 'generational' or more 'iterative'. That's why I am unsure exactly what MS will do but they do need to replace the Base hardware sooner rather than later but whether they allow the X to buy them time or not, we will see.

@BAMozzy
There's supposed to be at least two new xbox consoles being new gen and that seems to contradict what Phil was saying before, supposedly there wouldn't be new gen but some mythical forward comp. Anyway.
Seems the right way to go for Ms. They will have a very cheap new console for streaming and then a mid and a prime console. Phil said recently they are conceived with that streaming ability in mind.
AMD said Sony and Ms have each their own 'special sauce' to sell their consoles. It's going to be nteresting to see the different approach.

@JJ2 There are several rumours surrounding Xbox and some people putting 2 and 2 together and coming up with various hypotheses regarding their plans- anything from a low, mid and high end Xbox to a traditional and a streaming console - all MS have said is that they want their games to be playable on multiple devices and that 'streaming' is one way of delivering games. That may mean multiple consoles launching at a similar point (like a low and high end, like a streaming and a traditional console) but could mean that they release a 'traditional' console with the 'X' being the low end and a higher spec iterative upgrade after a few years, they could release a tablet (an Xbox Surface?) and/or phone for streaming your games for mobile gaming and we know they already have PC's as an option too to bring Xbox games (inc their Back Catalogue) to MS gamers. I have seen quite a few rumours and speculation that vary too much where as Sony's plan seems a little more straightforward at the moment.

Sony are 'likely' to bring out a successor to their PS4 and its likely to be a 'next gen' console in the traditional sense. Specs are somewhat a rumour - anything from a single APU comprising of a Zen architecture CPU and a Navi based GPU with Sony's own 'secret sauce' built in to a more PC like separate CPU and GPU using the same Zen & Navi specs. Either way, the PS4 and PS4 Pro will be replaced by a PS5 as the lead platform like every other new generation Playstation. Streaming/cloud computing hasn't really been mentioned which could allow Sony to release a handheld device to play your games on the go but as far as the rumours go, Sony seem to be following a traditional path with a 'new gen' console coming to succeed the PS4.

No doubt the next few years will be exciting. Either way, I intend to get both MS's and Sony's new consoles. I don't want to miss out on 'exclusive's' from either and I would prefer that both are 'relatively' equal in game visuals and performance. I don't want to 'favour' one with the other being more of a device for those exclusives. I like having the opportunity to pick which version of games I buy and basing it on other factors that aren't visual or frame rate performance - things like price or bonuses.

@BAMozzy
I posted this earlier on case you missed it. There was a link to the full article too.
I'm really not sure what to make of it.
Phil S
'we’re actually designing our next-gen silicon in such a way that it works great for playing games in the cloud, and also works very well for machine learning and other non-entertainment workloads. As a company like Microsoft, we can dual-purpose the silicon that we’re putting in.

We have a consumer use for that silicon, and we have enterprise use for those blades as well. It all in our space around driving down the cost to serve. Your cost to serve is made up by two things, how much was the hardware, and how much time does that hardware monetize.

So if we can monetize that hardware over more cycles in the 24 hours through game streaming and other things that need CPU and GPU in the cloud, we will drive down the cost to serve in our services. So the design as we move forward is done hand-in-hand with the Azure silicon team, and I think that creates a real competitive advantage.”

@JJ2 I did see the interview with Phil when he made that statement. Again that just reinforces the cloud computing aspect and network as it could mean just consoles of varying styles and/or specs, or could mean that the silicon they are designing is to go in more than just their console - such as their Surface range or maybe even their (Nokia) mobiles as its likely to be built on 7nm and should be 'small' and low power enough for these devices too.

Its no secret that MS want to make games that also harness the power of the cloud - Crackdown 3 is supposed to with its MP and all that destruction in that mode is supposed to be boosted by the cloud. The next Xbox could be 'relatively' low specced BUT boosted by the cloud to be as powerful (or more than) a high end PC. Whether that means that the console 'MUST' be online or not, I don't know but I hope that means that if you are online, you get better graphics, better destruction etc - by that I mean that you get more particles (inc destruction particles, dust etc), ray tracing, higher visual settings etc all without impacting on frame rates but more 'console' like settings if you aren't online. Online MP/co-op could obviously be boosted regardless as you need to be online anyway so I was referring more to SP campaigns. I don't know how people would feel if they could only play games if they are always connected to an online service just for 'better' graphics and so I do hope that its an optional boost and without that 'boost' you get more traditional 'console' settings - if that makes sense.

To me that's what I read into that statement. MS can make their devices relatively 'low spec' and thus keep the cost low and use Azure to 'boost' the performance. Locally, the hardware may only be a bit more powerful than an X with a much better CPU but with Azure, be much more powerful than they could build and sell for say $500 - the 'normal' console price.

By building their Silicon to work with Azure, that opens up devices like Surface and Mobiles to stream their games - obviously their digital library - to play even the latest games on the go - all you need is a MS account and an MS device so when you are out, you can play on your Surface and then when you get home, play on your Xbox or PC. Xbox may have 'some' advantages too - such as the added high end bonuses that Azure could offer where as PC may well be 'limited' to the local hardware but obviously, a high end PC can deliver the high end experience anyway.

The likes of a Surface or Mobile would only need to offer HD and maybe 30-60fps so maybe can run games purely in the cloud and the Xbox would need to be 4k so runs partly locally and boosted by cloud to deliver the high-end PC experience without having the price tag or local specs to match.

That's what I read into that. Its possible that MS could also offer a low cost 'streaming' box too - if it works for tablets and mobiles, it can work for this too. It could be 'small' enough to plug into existing laptops for 'on the go' gaming. It could be a USB stick - like Amazon's Firestick - especially if all its doing is connecting to your MS account and enabling you to stream games that are running purely in the cloud. It could be 'cheap' and offer Game-Pass and 'Gold' subscriptions so you have an immediate library of games to play without needing to buy any games at all.

Anyway, this is a bit off-topic as this is more about Sony's upcoming console rather than MS's plans.

So between TLOU 2, GoT and DS if PS5 is march 2020 then 2 of these are probably cross gen launch window games.

@WebHead Or Remastered versions of those games.